So long story short… I lost my medical 3 years ago as a CFI and just recently received it back. I'm doing an electronic logbook through LogTen. I pulled out my old flight records and noticed I'm missing one document out of three that contained 100 flight hours from ATP when I was started Part 141. I later dropped out of 141 and continued 61. I'm freaking out because I read through the 14CFR 141.101. (down below)
(d) The holder of a pilot school certificate or a provisional pilot school certificate must retain each student record required by this section for at least 1 year from the date that the student:
(1) Graduates from the course to which the record pertains;
(2) Terminates enrollment in the course to which the record pertains; or
(3) Transfers to another school.
(e) The holder of a pilot school certificate or a provisional pilot school certificate must make a copy of the student's training record available upon request by the student.
141.101 (e) does not state a given time. But 141.101(d) does. I'm super confused if I should be able to receive these records again or not. I want to make sure I can get these records and show ATP if they're in the wrong if they do not have these records on file anymore. I have the TOTAL hours of when I was at the Part 141 school recorded through my paper logbook but not the individual flights with the dates and times. I have no idea how to even go about that in my Logten entries either. I feel like this might be an issue with future employers if I do not have the original electronic copies of each log entry. I also feel like ATP really screwed me by only making an electronic entries during my training and not adding them into my paper logbook. If ATP doesn't have my records anymore, is there a way I can “fight” this issue per 141.101 maybe even with AOPA's help? If ATP is only required to hold onto training records for 1 year, is their a probability this might be an issue with airlines? How should I log my time in Logten missing 100 hr individual log entries? (again I am a CFI now and my part 141 program was through instrument - commercial so many DPE's have signed off my IACRA by approving all my logbook entries from the past). Thank you!
As far as the rules on the records are concerned, yes, the school must provide copies of the records it has on you, but they can't be compelled to provide copies of records they are no longer required to keep. They might still have those records, in which case they must provide them, but if they were purged a year after you left (i.e., two years ago), they're gone, and there's nothing you can do about it. The only way to find out is to contact ATP and see if they still have them, in which case they should provide them.
As for how to insert those hours into your LogTen files, you'd have to ask LogTen.
What will the airlines think if you hand them a logbook with 100 hours of lumped-together time? Hard to say. You've got the 8710-1's which the FAA considers a legal time record to support future certificate/rating applications if your logbook goes missing, but the airlines are free to take their own positions. Only the airline can answer this question.
If there's a lesson to be learned, it's that your logbook is your own personal responsibility. Never rely on others to maintain records to support it. In my 6000 hours of instructing, I've always logged the time in my logbook contemporaneously with the flying no matter who else is also keeping track of the time.
A better question would be “What would the FAA think if you hand them a logbook with 100 hours of lumped-together time?”
Look at 61.51(b)(1), which requires logging the specified information for a each flight or leson. Trying to cram multiple flights into a one line entry doesn’t appear to meet this requirement.
They put a huge sticker in your logbook at ATP that states “SEE ELECTRONIC STUDENT RECORD. Pilot logbook entries for activities conducted in ATP 141 courses are maintained in the school's electronic student record (ESR). The ESR is the official record. All other records are for informational purposes only and may contain inaccuracies. A certified copy of ESR will be provided upon course graduation, withdrawal, or termination." It covers one whole page of my logbook." I asked my instructor at the time and he told me the sticker with my electronic logbook is all I would need to record my hours. As a CFI now, I'm thinking how ridiculous this is now. I should of definitely logged each time and date.
If an inspector cannot see the electronic student record, then the requirements of 61.51(b) have not been met. They should, as a matter of course, provide you with a copy of your electronic student record when they put the sticker in your logbook.
Fast Update: Left a message for ATP on their voicemail. Went full out crazy woman on my files.. I FOUND ANOTHER COPY OF MY ESR tucked away in my files from flight training!!!! I'm going to make probably another 4 copies so this doesn't happen and log them into my Logten. All that worry for nothing. Thank you guys for your output.
As a CFI now, I'm thinking how ridiculous this is now. I should of definitely logged each time and date.
Exactly! It's YOUR logbook, YOUR certificate, and YOUR future at stake, so it's up to YOU to ensure it all meets FAA requirements. Now go, and sin no more…